MMA - help me understand

Styles, training, conditioning, equipment - everything related to Martial Arts.

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Postby tempehmomma » Tue Jul 22, 2008 8:04 pm

[quote="omar tan"]Any fight with BJ Penn or Anderson Silva is great, I think. Anderson Silva hasn't been challenged by anybody, but in his prime neither was Roy Jones Jr. Still great to watch.
Roy Jones Jr.! :roll: The light heavyweight divison in boxing has never been that competitive. It's the 25 and over middle weight division for boxers who can't make 160lbs at weigh in anymore. :lol:
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Postby No other way » Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:14 am

i'm tired of all these threads.go to mmascraps.com watch the top 10 fights. you'll get your excitment.

watch the crocop vs. alexander emilienako fight. then watch fedors reaction. then watch the documentary. then watch the fedor crocop fight. it will give you tons of build up and that fight had me on the edge of my seat.
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Postby SpugFab » Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:28 am

[quote="No other way"]i'm tired of all these threads.go to mmascraps.com watch the top 10 fights. you'll get your excitment.

If you think this is tiring try the "I've actually had a fight" ground fighting threads...

[quote="No other way"]then watch fedors reaction

EDGE OF THE SEAT!!!
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xm18c_fedor-fache_sport
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Postby Heinrich » Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:01 am

To me, alot of the exitement in MMA fights comes with knowledge about the fighters and their styles/skills.
If you dont know anything about Mirco Filipović and Mark Coleman that fight is probably not so fun to watch. But if you do know their strengths it gets exiting as hell.

You dont seem to like Jiu-Jitsu so you might not get exited by this:
Sakuraba vs Newton
I think its a hell of a fight.

Also check out:
Chuck Liddell vs Alistair Overeem

I personally dont care much about what happens between the fighters before the fight so I cant really point you to anything there.
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Postby SpugFab » Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:44 am

[quote="Heinrich"]To me, alot of the exitement in MMA fights comes with knowledge about the fighters and their styles/skills.

I think this is where my interest in mma comes from too. Even as primarily a boxing fan it's the match up of styles that provides the interest. If you don't know the sport there's no way you'll ge the full enjoyment of out watching it.

[quote="Heinrich"]You dont seem to like Jiu-Jitsu so you might not get exited by this:
Sakuraba vs Newton
I think its a hell of a fight.

Lol, my problem isn't with Jiu-Jitsu, it's with the control that Jitsu seems to have over mma rule-setting to bias it in favour of grapplers (damn you jitsu mafia). But that's a topic for another thread :wink:

I really like that fight, I actually mentioned it in the "Favourite Fighters, Favourite Fight thread".
http://www.veganfitness.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10230&start=31
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Postby puppydog » Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:48 am

[quote="spug myers"]I Am A TROLL


+1


:wink:
Arf! Arf! Grrrr! Arf!
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Postby SpugFab » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:14 am

[quote="omar tan"]I'd say the Forrest Griffin/Rampage fighht was pretty great. Actually, most fights with Griffin are entertaining.

Any fight with BJ Penn or Anderson Silva is great, I think. Anderson Silva hasn't been challenged by anybody, but in his prime neither was Roy Jones Jr. Still great to watch.

Spencer Fisher has had some very entertaining, closely fought, slugfests.

Antonio Noguiera vs. Tim Sylvia was a great fight.

Yeah I'm struggling to think of great fights too.

Pretty great seems to be quite a step down to me...

I'm just reassessing my sporting spectator portfolio at the moment, especially with the upcoming Olympics. What a fantastic opportunity to enjoy sports I wouldn't normally watch.

Thinking back over the years I've been watching mma I'm getting the feeling the highs haven't warranted the time invested in it. The same can't be said of boxing, the amazing fights trip off the tongue. Benn-Eubank, Eubank-Watson, Hearns-Leonard, Duran-Barkley, Morales-Barrera, Bowe-Golota... You know no boxing fans are struggling so hard when asked about great fights that they have to quote Roy Jones as being great to watch.

I think back to the mma fights which got me excited beforehand - recently Rampage-Chuck, Sherk-Penn, GSP-Hughes, Silva-Franklin and so on. All straightforward wins with few thrills. Even looking at the mmascraps top 20 fights, there are few fights involving two top fighters in there. Think back over the history of the UFC - what are the great title fights?

MMA fails to deliver!

There - it's been said.

Moving on a little from the overt trolling - is MMA becoming less interesting to watch? To me it's much better than it was in the very early days of the UFC, but so many of those top fights are from bygone years in PRIDE - what are the reasons for that?
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Postby Heinrich » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:52 am

Nanana! Arent we a bit harsh with our judgement there...

Dont you think that the reason why you dont get the same exitement out of MMA fights as you get from boxing might lie in the very nature of MMA?

Due to lack of protection and submissions availible in MMA so many fights end straight forward. There is less space to recover from a hard hit. Its often one technique that has to get through and the fight is over.
Where boxers can get hit again and again, each punch as a much bigger impact in MMA.
Thats why there arent as many back and forth and back and forth fights.
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Postby tempehmomma » Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:38 pm

[quote="Heinrich"]Due to lack of protection and submissions availible in MMA so many fights end straight forward. There is less space to recover from a hard hit. Its often one technique that has to get through and the fight is over.
Where boxers can get hit again and again, each punch as a much bigger impact in MMA.
Thats why there arent as many back and forth and back and forth fights.
Heinrich good point.

spug, how many ounces due the gloves pro boxers wear in a match weigh compared to grapplng gloves.
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Postby No other way » Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:55 pm

[quote="spug_myers"]

MMA fails to deliver!

There - it's been said.



i just think you're biased. i just told you where to find 12 great fights but since you are more of a boxing fan than mma you don't find them entertaining. i think most boxing is boring. so if i was the one asking for exciting boxing matches you could give me a million of them and i wouldn't find them interesting. the reason i don't like boxing is because they are so so long. i know not all go the full time but you could go rounds of just jabs and counters before you get to anything substantial. i understand that jabs are an important part to breaking down your opponent but i think just boxing or just kick boxing or just grappling is boring. it's the different styles and all the chances for an end to a fight is exciting to me. in boxing there are only a couple of ways it can end. in mma there are hundreds of ways a fight can end.

so to end my rant. you don't like mma because you don't like mma. i don't like boxing because i don't like boxing. different strokes for different folks
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Postby SpugFab » Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:15 pm

[quote="tempehmomma"][quote="Heinrich"]Due to lack of protection and submissions availible in MMA so many fights end straight forward. There is less space to recover from a hard hit. Its often one technique that has to get through and the fight is over.
Where boxers can get hit again and again, each punch as a much bigger impact in MMA.
Thats why there arent as many back and forth and back and forth fights.
Heinrich good point.

It is a good point, and it's part of the overall point I've been making for the duration of this thread :roll:

Perhaps the ability to have some back and forth is an essential part of what makes for good spectator sport? To be on the ropes, resources spent, to reach down inside yourself and tough it out and overmaster your opponent. That's an exciting thing to me. The clinical nature of MMA fights perhaps precludes that particular thrill.
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Postby SpugFab » Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:27 pm

[quote="No other way"]i just think you're biased. i just told you where to find 12 great fights but since you are more of a boxing fan than mma you don't find them entertaining.

First up, I'm a big fan of mma. I've been to fight nights, both domestic and UFC. I've trained at a number of gyms. A few of my friends fight (I don't). I can't remember the last UFC event I didn't watch. So you're off track there.

I was asking the MMA fans which fights had thrilled them (not where I could find a list on another site, kind of misses the point of discussion). We all watch quite a lot of the sport, which fights have we found completely grippiing.

As a boxing fan I can think of 30 or 40 fights of the top of my head which I consider "epic". As a football fan I can think of games which astounded me. The recent tennis final at Wimbledon seems to have been awesome enough to enthrall the country (I missed the last couple of sets). I can recognise great sport.

Thinking back on my time watching MMA, I'm struggling to remember these great sporting moments. I find it interesting, I love to see how one style will match against another, but I'm beginning to suspect it doesn't have as much potential to amaze as other sports do.

[quote="No other way"]the reason i don't like boxing is because they are so so long.

36 minutes maximum. Way too long to follow a sport, I agree.
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Postby No other way » Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:49 pm

the crocop fedor fight thrilled me. you had asked what everyones favorite fight was. i can't think of 1 favorite fight over the rest. i can however name several great fights generally with the people listed as my favorite fighters. i feel like that goes the same with everyone that posted in the mma version of that thread.

47 minutes with all the breaks. then pile on all the hugging and nonaction. it gets really boring to me. to sit there and watch the same style for that long.
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Postby prenna » Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:19 am

[quote="tempehmomma"]One of the reasons why MMA is popular is because if the top pro boxer fought the top pro MMA fighter in ANY weight division the boxer would get destroyed.


I wanted to stick in my 2cents with regard to this. If any top pro MMA fighter fought any top pro boxer using boxing rules the MMA fighter would get destroyed. No "well rounded" mma fighter of note has the boxing skill to hold their own in a boxing match.

The fact is they are two different sports. Apples and oranges imho.
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Postby prenna » Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:30 am

For the original question I quess there's a few fights that have had me on the edge of my seat. Most of the fights in WEC 34 (except the first fight) were awesome. The title fight between Faber and Pulver had me on the edge of my seat almost as much as the Maeda/Torres bantamweight bout.

GSP/Hughes III thrilled me too from a geeky perspective. Seeing GSP applying two submissions at the same time and then rolling out into a third submission had me almost jumping up and down.

Most exciting for me is every time Megumi Fuji enters the ring/cage. Amazing and exciting fighter who I'd love to watch destroy Gina Carano.

I do think, however, that mma in the US is becoming much less exciting over time. Personally I blame TUF. In post-TUF America mma is becoming homogenised where even guys who are meant to be judo stylists or something enter the cage and act just like every other UFC fighter (namely Thai kick-Thai kick-jab-cross-shoot). I think the sport in Japan is much more diverse and interesting.
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