Beating myself up about leather seats....

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Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby crazant » Tue Apr 02, 2013 9:25 am

I'm having a mid life cricis and am going to buy a Mk3 MX5 I've hunted high and low and have finally found a very nice car...( 2006 sport with full Mazda History and some warranty left)
To get a decent spec and better engine etc you have to buy the 2.0 Sport but it does come with heated leather seats as well as steering wheel and gear stick gator...

I'm beating myself up about the seats, I've been Vegan for over 20 years and don't really like leather seats as seats anyway so swopping the seats out for cloth ones seems an easy option there are plenty on ebay as most people go the other way..and it is only 4 bolts and one plug..
But i keep asking myself whats the point of changing the seats if the steering wheel and gator are leather and even if i could change them whats the point cos i believe all car tyres have something in them anyway....I'm sure most cars are non vegan...

Also thinking about it if i buy the car with all the leather is it any different if i keep the seats sat in the attic while I use the cloth versions after all I've still paid for them....

Don't know what I'm asking really just wondered if anyone had any thoughts ?

Confused
Anthony
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby Orkje » Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:53 am

I understand the feeling and I think it's not just a vegan issue, but also (and maybe even more of) an ecological one. I sometimes restore old bicycles and they often come with leather saddles (sometimes in very good condition).
Personally, I think it's alright to buy something second-hand which contains non-vegan "parts" (e.g. the saddle of a bike, the seats of a car) if it means you're saving something from the scrapyard.

That being said, the leather saddles I've got are sitting on shelf and have been replaced with vegan ones. Do I feel like I'm supporting the leather industry? No.

I'm not sure whether or not that answers your question. Any comments would be appreciated.
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby crazant » Tue Apr 02, 2013 12:11 pm

Hi Thanks for the reply, Changing the seats is easy and I'm all set to do this, its the nagging question about why change the seats if there are other parts on the car that aren't vegan:
Steering wheel
Gator
Tyres
I believe brake fluid has animal in it...

Where do we stop ?
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby Orkje » Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:32 pm

Point taken. I've got a car too, and I've never thought about the animal origin of some components. I can't come up with a straightforward answer, though... Anyone?
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby loveliberate » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:01 pm

If you don't feel that you really need a non-vegan or otherwise not particularly ethical item, it's best to skip it. If you're getting something of the sort regardless and a more vegan-friendly alternative is available, go with that. Otherwise, while I wouldn't worry about personal purity or "perfection" - I also wouldn't feel good about having leather seats, etc and would probably at least put cloth seat covers over them.
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby tomforster » Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:19 am

I'm always troubled regarding a faux leather jacket i have, while no harm has been caused in recieving it as a gift, i feel like me wearing it might influence any designers that see it to sort of believe leather jackets are in fashion and produce more. a bit of a moral dilemma for me there. haha
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby silver » Thu Apr 04, 2013 2:55 pm

There is no doubt it's hypocritical to have a car with leather seats, but we're all hypocrits somewhere along the line and it is just drawing the line where we are comfortable.
Even were we able to source vegan products for all purposes, we still have to kill caterpillars to grow cabbages.
Draw your own line, you only have to justify it to yourself. If you don't think it's right then just don't do it!

...and really? an MX5? That's not a proper mid-life crisis car!
It's not what you do occasionally that makes a difference, it's that which you do everyday that brings progress.

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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby XkillerX » Thu Apr 04, 2013 4:45 pm

The mx5 handles well but it's woefully underpowered and has very little package space.

Get something with fakey leather (it's tough to tell but it seems to me most cheap sports cars use fake leather and expensive ones alcantara - executive cars get murder) and a supercharger.

Or better yet, an SLK350.

Michelin tyres are animal free.

As for being perfect, instead of denying yourselves the pleasures of life (like bicycling and driving a cabriolet) you might as well get the car you crave so much and just spend an extra hour every week advocating veganism (leafleting , bugging companies, supporting activists/organizations etc). After all, you never know, you might get disappointed with your selection and sell the leather seated car next year, but the changes that you make and made cant be denied.
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby xrodolfox » Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:01 pm

I am of two minds, and these two posts tell what I'm thinking.

[quote="loveliberate"]If you don't feel that you really need a non-vegan or otherwise not particularly ethical item, it's best to skip it. If you're getting something of the sort regardless and a more vegan-friendly alternative is available, go with that. Otherwise, while I wouldn't worry about personal purity or "perfection" - I also wouldn't feel good about having leather seats, etc and would probably at least put cloth seat covers over them.


[quote="XkillerX"]As for being perfect, instead of denying yourselves the pleasures of life (like bicycling and driving a cabriolet) you might as well get the car you crave so much and just spend an extra hour every week advocating veganism (leafleting , bugging companies, supporting activists/organizations etc). After all, you never know, you might get disappointed with your selection and sell the leather seated car next year, but the changes that you make and made cant be denied.
"The worker has the right to leave his boss, but can she do it? And if she does quit him, is it in order to lead a free life; where she will have no master but herself? No, she leaves to sell herself to another employer. She's driven by the same hunger. Thus the worker's liberty is only a theoretical freedom, lacking any means of realization; an utter falsehood."
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby Wobbly Lifter » Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:15 am

My 20 year old BMW has leather seats. I love them.
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby thestoatyone » Sun Apr 07, 2013 8:19 pm

I'd go for one of two options:

a) Buy the 2.0 and swap the seats out. Sell 'em and give some of the dosh to a local animal sanctuary

b) Buy a really cheap 1.6, chuck the engine and get someone to shoehorn a V8 in. This is one of my dream projects for the next deacde (rover V8, there millions of the buggers around.

Also, SLKs are the sports car equivalent of a piles cushion.
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby veganbikenut » Thu May 02, 2013 9:02 am

Apart from the car comments and chat above, I am no car expert, when people ask me what car I have I just reply a silver VW, my knowledge is mountain bikes not cars but it is always worth remembering the original statement from the Vegan Society.

[quote] the Society remains as determined as ever to promote vegan lifestyles - that is, ways of living that seek to exclude, as far as is possible and practical


In reality it is not possible to be as vegan as we would like in life because it is not possible and practical, so do not beat yourself up.
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby XkillerX » Sun May 19, 2013 8:41 pm

So have you bought it yet? Has the local animals sanctuary gotten a donation?
Activists are the engineers of the soul. That's why governments lock them up.
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Re: Beating myself up about leather seats....

Postby veganjohnson » Tue Sep 02, 2014 2:44 pm

I was recently left a set of vintage pearls by my grandmother. Its not and easy thing to deal with to be honest but they have sentimental value and I don't want to get rid of them. I think I would feel differently if they were cultured pearls like those at http://www.mesenso.com/. I realise that the conch is killed when the pearls are removed but natural pearls are at least not farmed specifically for that purpose. Still it's certainly a bit of a contentious issue in our household.
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