Mike Tyson doesn't go vegan

[Ava Odoéména]

I've started a new thread because the issue is important.

Mike Tyson hasn't gone vegan, he's merely adopted the vegan diet, hence is a vegan dieter.

A vegan dieter is not a vegan, because veganism is not about diet. The food a *vegan* eats is a consequence of an ethical philosophy, not a prime motivation.

The very point of veganism which distinguishes it from vegetarianism, is the *extension* beyond food, incorporating the rejection of all avoidalbe things made from animals, including leather, fur, wool, silk or cosmetics/medication tested on animals.

There are bucketloads of celebrities who are following a vegan diet and don't care about animals. You must not care about animals if you are a vegan dieter, as only vegans are into that ethical stuff. So I got no problem with people who do not care about animals but who are vegan dieting, however, this is political of course.

It's detrimental to the vegan philosophy if our values are dilluted into a food choice, I think its wrong. I'm very happy Mr. Tyson has become a vegan dieter, I'm all for it.

However, it's important to keep the distinction between the hip people and us nutty extremists.

[Hiking Fox]

What she just said.

Fuck celebrities and their trends.

[TMH]

Lol! And !@#$ others who must label/place others in boxes...

[Hiking Fox]

The very point of veganism which distinguishes it from vegetarianism, is the *extension* beyond food, incorporating the rejection of all avoidalbe things made from animals, including leather, fur, wool, silk or cosmetics/medication tested on animals.

The other reason celebs like this shouldn't be promoted as vegan is that they change their minds like traffic lights (or are misrepresented in the first place) and therefore make us look really stupid.

A while back, the world famous model Naomi Campbell was hailed as having gone vegetarian. Next minute, she was an evil fur promoter. Around ten years ago, wide celebrations because Madonna was vegan. Next thing, Madonna was nuts and everybody should boycott her gigs because she'd married a fanatical pheasant shooter. Around the same time, one lot of animal rights activists handed out info at Blur gigs about how the singer/spokesperson Damon Albarn was veggie, while another lot protested outside the gigs and (allegedly) stickered the band's album in shops because it promoted greyhound racing.

Even further back: was Morrissey an ethical veggie or a raving racist nazi who wanted all the immigrants to get out of Britain? Was that singer from Kula Shaker a spiritual peace-loving veggie or a swastica lover who thought disabled people are learning through bad karma?

Celebrities make us look stupid. Please ignore their flirtations with the vegetarian/vegan diet. It can be really embarrassing.

[XkillerX]

I'm glad you two brought this up.

See this is why we need some SERIOUS kick-ass celebreties, and not some wankers who (like just about everybody) follow trends and give into this and cave into that. We need a celeb who will not waste time faffing aboot and who will take a bunch of his own money he/she/both takes from stupid ass earth destroying sponsor companies, and tell the couch potato lazy ass spoiled shit inhabitants of the "developed", "undeveloped", first, second, third, fourth and seventyfifth world to stop being lazy selfish fuckheads, grow some pubic hair and go vegan!!! (or die)

Lacking such real life celebrity.... I propose:

[bob_summers]

i hear what you're saying, though i'm not sure if it's just celebs that are capable of being rubbish vegans. i knew an ex-vegan who went back to eating meat as veganism was, she told everybody, making her ill. despite drinking 2L of diet coke a day.
i know another who went from hunt sabber, to sab hunter. etc.

one positive thing about mr tyson being vegan, is that he looks like he eats rather a lot. so, for whatever period of time he does stay vegan, that's a fair amount of animal products unconsumed.

[iain_g]

Some good posts here
Particularly enjoyed Hiking Fox's.

[Johnboy74]

I thought as much...
Hijacking the real through imitation and passing it off as the real thing, oh these hyperreal postmodern times of the real and fantasy. People believing fantasy is the real thing, wake up fantasists, realists will catch you out.

[Ava Odoéména]

i hear what you're saying, though i'm not sure if it's just celebs that are capable of being rubbish vegans. i knew an ex-vegan who went back to eating meat as veganism was, she told everybody, making her ill. despite drinking 2L of diet coke a day.
i know another who went from hunt sabber, to sab hunter. etc.

People who eat flesh or hunt are not rubbish vegans. They are simply not vegan. But what's your point here actually? Because some vegans fall off the wagon, we should submit to the hollowing out of our principles?

one positive thing about mr tyson being vegan, is that he looks like he eats rather a lot. so, for whatever period of time he does stay vegan, that's a fair amount of animal products unconsumed.

There can't be anything positiv about Mr. Tyson being vegan, because Mr. Tyson is not a vegan. He's a vegan dieter. It's odd you claim to hear what I'm saying, yet continue to engage in exactly what I was concerend about:-)

I agree that it's positive that Mr. Tyson has opted to follow a vegan diet. I was thrilled when I found out. However, I will only speak of him as a vegan when he subscribes to vegan values and ethical code.

[Ava Odoéména]

oh these hyperreal postmodern times of the real and fantasy.

Especially in combination with nihilism a toxic mix, turning people into plants that are swaying in the winds of chaos. Like a flock of blind birds they smash from one wall into another, survivers then again multiply and rise up once more towards the next wall...

Postmoderinty it seems, can be summoned up in it's replacement of reason with the laws of physics... Not so modern after all. Or does the "post" there indicate, that whatever is here now has eaten the true achievements of modernity?

This is why I love veganism. An ethical orthodoxy which stands firm in the stream of the managed meaninglessness which constitutes postmodern times.

[Ava Odoéména]

Lacking such real life celebrity.... I propose:

Hmmmm:-)

An art about control, by an artist who himself is almost completely out of control:-) Oh you thought it was about veganism. I then doubt you've had the pleasure to engage with the refreshing personality of Mr. Hummel.

And people think I have assholistic tendencies?:P

[bob_summers]

ava, i still agree with you, i don't care what you say
'rubbish vegan' was a term of convenience.. and i was only half serious about the number of animals mr tyson is not going to consume.
anyways the point was that people like me, who knows nothing about the likes of madonna, blur and iron mike, are more likely to have our views on veganism coloured by friends', or friends of friends' experiences than those of celebrities. hence the relevance of the hunting/diet coke.

[JP]

so can there be a vegan restaurant?

can food be vegan? So no "vegan sausages" - just "sausages that are suitable for vegans (and dietary "vegans")?

And where did you find evidence that Mike Tyson is only a dietary vegan?

I dont believe in inspecting peoples reasons and motives too strictly, but if someone is vegan it means they wouldnt use leather etc, so i cant see how they would only be it for dietary reasons.

[bob_summers]

I dont believe in inspecting peoples reasons and motives too strictly, but if someone is vegan it means they wouldnt use leather etc, so i cant see how they would only be it for dietary reasons.

there's a large percentage of non-vegans on this board...
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=12086&hilit=vegan+poll


witchhunt

[JP]

motivation to go vegan is a different issue though

Someone might have health as their primary motive but are vegan as in do not use leather or anything like that - but priorities may vary.

Which is why such strict inspection of motives and everything is doomed to fail from the start.